本期仁醫(yī)醫(yī)療特別邀請(qǐng)到國(guó)際著名腎臟科專(zhuān)家Prof. Michael Fischereder做專(zhuān)題訪問(wèn)。Prof. Fischereder現(xiàn)任慕尼黑大學(xué)醫(yī)學(xué)院教授、慕尼黑大學(xué)醫(yī)院移植中心腎臟科主任、德國(guó)內(nèi)科醫(yī)生專(zhuān)業(yè)學(xué)會(huì)（BDI）巴伐利亞分會(huì)副主席。

因?yàn)橥昱d趣和中學(xué)的經(jīng)歷堅(jiān)定了Prof. Fischereder成為醫(yī)生的信念。他鼓勵(lì)年輕醫(yī)生多到不同醫(yī)療機(jī)構(gòu)學(xué)習(xí)，找到自己的方法和研究興趣。作為德國(guó)腎移植專(zhuān)家，Prof. Fischereder分享了疫情之下，德國(guó)醫(yī)院腎內(nèi)科遇到的挑戰(zhàn)與應(yīng)對(duì)。

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1、您是何時(shí)決定從醫(yī)的呢？又為什么專(zhuān)攻腎內(nèi)科呢？

Why did you decide to pursue a career in medicine and why, in particular, did you decide to specialize in nephrology?

我在童年時(shí)期就對(duì)科學(xué)、自然科學(xué)和生物學(xué)等非常感興趣。當(dāng)我到了該考慮職業(yè)的時(shí)候，我發(fā)現(xiàn)照護(hù)病人非常有意思。于是我在中學(xué)時(shí)期成為了一名救護(hù)車(chē)急救志愿者，這段經(jīng)驗(yàn)也堅(jiān)定了我成為一名醫(yī)生的信念。

關(guān)于專(zhuān)攻腎內(nèi)科那就是另一回事了。那時(shí)我在慕尼黑大學(xué)醫(yī)學(xué)院上學(xué)，期間我去了美國(guó)參加選修培訓(xùn)課程，并有機(jī)會(huì)在一家腎移植中心學(xué)習(xí)，不僅是學(xué)習(xí)外科手術(shù)，還有腎內(nèi)科的培訓(xùn)。那是在1986年，我遇見(jiàn)了我生命中第一位對(duì)我大力支持的導(dǎo)師Karl Nath，當(dāng)時(shí)他是腎內(nèi)科的主治醫(yī)生。我在美國(guó)接受培訓(xùn)期間他非常支持我，也是他建議我成為一名腎病科醫(yī)生。他為我選了一條非常適合我的道路。

Early on in childhood, I was very interested in science, natural science, biology. And when I was eventually thinking about career options, I found taking care of sick patients very interesting and wanted to learn more. And that actually is what brought me to volunteer time with a paramedic unit early on, still as a student at school, and eventually strengthened my understanding that I want to become a physician, a medical doctor.

With respect to nephrology, it was a different thing, because I went abroad to the United States for an elective training period, while still in medical school in Munich. At that time, I had the opportunity to visit a renal transplant service from either the surgical side and also the nephrology part. It was then, back in 1986, when I met my first very supportive mentor, Karl Nath, who was an attending nephrologist at that time on the consult service. He really supported me all along through my training and it was his interest to turn me into a nephrologist. And he was right. I think he made a very good suggestion for me.

2、您的早年經(jīng)歷如何塑造你的成就？

How did your early youth experience shape your success?

我是我們家第一個(gè)醫(yī)生，我們家之前也沒(méi)出過(guò)多少科學(xué)家。在我成長(zhǎng)的過(guò)程中，陪伴我的是住在附近的朋友們，大家雖然興趣不同，但是都非常有抱負(fù)。他們中有些人對(duì)銀行業(yè)感興趣，有些人對(duì)計(jì)算機(jī)科學(xué)感興趣，還有些人在軍隊(duì)中追求理想。由于我一直都對(duì)自然科學(xué)和醫(yī)學(xué)感興趣，也因?yàn)樵谶@樣一個(gè)有抱負(fù)且雄心勃勃的環(huán)境中成長(zhǎng)，讓我從醫(yī)學(xué)生一直到我成為醫(yī)生都備受鼓舞。

I am the first physician in our family. And actually, there aren't too many advanced scientists in our family, either. So when I grew up, I was in an environment with many friends from the neighborhood, who all were very ambitious, but in with different interests. Some of them were interested in banking, others in computer science, and a few pursued careers in the military. And as I always had been interested in natural sciences and medicine, living in a competitive and ambitious environment was support for me also to pursue training in school and then advance to a career in medicine.

3、您職業(yè)生涯中是否有對(duì)您來(lái)說(shuō)很重要的導(dǎo)師，他們教會(huì)您什么，是如何啟發(fā)您的呢？

Who have been you greatest influences? What have they taught you and how have they inspired you?

對(duì)我影響最深刻的人是我的父母和我的兩位導(dǎo)師Karl Nath 和 Detlef Schl?ndorff。我的母親一直教導(dǎo)我，努力是取得成就的關(guān)鍵，叮囑我教書(shū)育人對(duì)學(xué)術(shù)生涯的重要性。我的父親是一個(gè)非常溫和的人，從他身上我意識(shí)到談判和人際交往技巧是多么重要。

我剛剛提到，在我醫(yī)學(xué)生涯和腎臟學(xué)的第一個(gè)導(dǎo)師是Karl Nath。他是第一個(gè)認(rèn)為我在腎臟病學(xué)領(lǐng)域有天分的人，并且支持我在此領(lǐng)域發(fā)展。在我留美接受內(nèi)科住院醫(yī)師培訓(xùn)的三年期間，他給予我非常大的幫助。

然后是我的導(dǎo)師Detlef Schl?ndorff ，他把我從美國(guó)帶回德國(guó)慕尼黑，并且助力我在德國(guó)的職業(yè)發(fā)展。我從Detlef Schl?ndorff 身上學(xué)到最寶貴的品質(zhì)：永遠(yuǎn)以數(shù)據(jù)和事實(shí)為標(biāo)準(zhǔn)，即使面對(duì)自己做出的研究或者是好朋友的研究，也要非常謹(jǐn)慎、富有批判精神，基于數(shù)據(jù)和事實(shí)進(jìn)行求證。

My greatest influences have been my parents and my mentors Karl Nath and Detlef Schl?ndorff. My mother, all along, taught me that it is crucial to work hard in order to achieve something. She always was the one who pointed out to me how important schooling in an academic career is. My father is a very gentle person who always showed me that negotiating and interpersonal skills are important, too.

My first, mentor in medicine and in nephrology, as I said early on, is Karl Nath. He really was the one who thought that I had a talent in nephrology and supported me that way. He helped me a great deal to also come to the United States and pursue a three-year clinical training there as an internal resident. From then on it was my mentor Detlef Schl?ndorff who brought me back to Munich, Germany, and supported my career here in Germany.

The most important thing I learned from Detlef Schl?ndorff is always to rely on data, rely on facts, and be very critical even if it comes to own research, even if it comes to research of close friends, to always, really look at the data and pursue research ideas based on facts.

4、從您自身經(jīng)驗(yàn)出發(fā)，對(duì)于一名醫(yī)生來(lái)說(shuō)，到不同醫(yī)院或者不同國(guó)家訪問(wèn)的重要性？

Based on your experience, how important is it for a medical doctor to visit different hospitals or different countries?

對(duì)我個(gè)人來(lái)說(shuō)，到不同醫(yī)院訪問(wèn)大有益處，我曾經(jīng)在德國(guó)和美國(guó)多家醫(yī)院接受過(guò)培訓(xùn)。不同醫(yī)院的病人癥狀也許是相似的，但是每個(gè)醫(yī)生的治療理念都是不一樣的。醫(yī)療系統(tǒng)的組織架構(gòu)也各有不同。對(duì)于我來(lái)說(shuō)，訪問(wèn)不同醫(yī)院能讓我反思不足，并且汲取不同醫(yī)療系統(tǒng)的優(yōu)點(diǎn)。

我在德國(guó)上醫(yī)學(xué)院時(shí)，感覺(jué)德國(guó)的醫(yī)學(xué)教育偏重理論。到了美國(guó)之后，我意識(shí)到了實(shí)戰(zhàn)訓(xùn)練的優(yōu)勢(shì)。對(duì)我來(lái)說(shuō)，兩種模式的結(jié)合才是最理想的方法。

當(dāng)我決定專(zhuān)攻腎臟病學(xué)時(shí)，我的第一份正式工作是在雷根斯堡大學(xué)醫(yī)院，跟隨著B(niǎo)ernhard Kr?mer教授，那里是學(xué)習(xí)臨床醫(yī)學(xué)和臨床研究的絕佳選擇。當(dāng)我回到慕尼黑大學(xué)醫(yī)院追隨我的導(dǎo)師 Detlef Schl?ndorff時(shí)，我看到大型科研機(jī)構(gòu)是如何進(jìn)行基礎(chǔ)科學(xué)并與臨床和科研相結(jié)合的。

我十分鼓勵(lì)年輕醫(yī)生多到不同的醫(yī)療機(jī)構(gòu)訪學(xué)，向不同的前輩學(xué)習(xí)，我相信每個(gè)醫(yī)生都會(huì)找到自己的方法，從不同的榜樣身上獲益。

For me, at least it was a great advantage to see different hospitals, and as you pointed out that I trained in a fair number of different hospitals, either here in Germany or the United States.

Although medical problems may be very similar, the personal attitude of treating physicians can be different and the overall organization of the medical system certainly are different. For me, this was a great way to really reflect on my training and gather different aspects of how medicine is practiced between the systems.

When I went to medical school in Germany, I felt that it was very driven by theory and learning from the books, then moving to the US I saw the advantage of very practical training. The two ways together formed, for me, the ideal approach. And likewise, when I then moved on to nephrology, my first staff position in Regensburg, with Prof. Bernhard Kr?mer, was a great site to learn clinical medicine and clinical research. And then moving back to my mentor Detlef Schl?ndorff here in Munich was an advantage to see basic science performed in a large institution and try to combine those two.

And I can only encourage people to move between institutions and learn from different people. Every individual doctor will find his or her own way how to personally profit from different role models.

5、作為多個(gè)腎臟病學(xué)相關(guān)科學(xué)學(xué)會(huì)的活躍成員，您認(rèn)為這些學(xué)會(huì)對(duì)學(xué)科和醫(yī)生有何重要意義？

As an active member of multiple societies of nephrology, how important do you think these societies are to the field of nephrology and to the physicians?

在我看來(lái)這些學(xué)會(huì)為大家提供了非常多組織良好的教育活動(dòng)，這也是我加入學(xué)會(huì)的價(jià)值所在。跟熱門(mén)學(xué)科如腫瘤學(xué)相比，腎臟病學(xué)是比較小眾的學(xué)科，同一時(shí)間沒(méi)有太多的科研項(xiàng)目。但是我認(rèn)為一個(gè)能夠幫助腎內(nèi)科醫(yī)生關(guān)注最新進(jìn)展的學(xué)會(huì)是非常有益處的。與此同時(shí)，這些學(xué)會(huì)為新手腎臟病學(xué)醫(yī)生提供特別的培訓(xùn)項(xiàng)目引導(dǎo)他們?nèi)腴T(mén)，這也是非常好的。

In my understanding, these societies offer a very good opportunity to organize structured educational activities. This is really, for me, the most added value from being in these societies. Even in a small field like nephrology with not so many research projects being done at the same time compared to fields like oncology, still, I find it helpful to have a society that helps all physicians in the field to focus on the most recent advances in the field. At the same time, these societies offer early-on support for novices in the field in order to get them introduced by special mentoring programs, which I find very fortunate.

6、您認(rèn)為科研對(duì)一個(gè)臨床醫(yī)生有何重要意義？

To a physician, how important is scientific research?

我認(rèn)為科研是每個(gè)醫(yī)生行醫(yī)的基礎(chǔ)，即使是不太積極參與科研的醫(yī)生，了解如何進(jìn)行科學(xué)研究、如何整理科研成果對(duì)他們來(lái)說(shuō)依然至關(guān)重要。因?yàn)橹委熁颊邞?yīng)該始終以堅(jiān)實(shí)的科學(xué)事實(shí)為基礎(chǔ)。當(dāng)然，成為一名好的醫(yī)生還需要良好的人際溝通技巧，但是科學(xué)事實(shí)是不可或缺的。

作為一名臨床研究人員，我發(fā)現(xiàn)把成果轉(zhuǎn)化到病人照護(hù)上的臨床研究也是非常重要的。一名好的醫(yī)生必須要有理解科研成果的能力，并不是說(shuō)每個(gè)醫(yī)生都得親自做科研項(xiàng)目，但是所有的治療方案都應(yīng)建立在科學(xué)數(shù)據(jù)和科研成果的基礎(chǔ)上。

I think scientific research is the basis for every physician, even for those who are not actively involved in research. Still, it is crucial that they understand how research is done and how research is reported. Because treating patients should always be driven by solid basic scientific facts. Of course, it takes other skills in interpersonal communication. But the scientific basis is crucial. 

And as I am a clinical researcher, I find, also, clinical research that can really be then translated into patient care important. In order to practice medicine, one has to be able to understand the results of research projects. Not necessarily every physician has to perform his or her own research. Every treatment should be driven by scientific data and based on solid research.

7、您如何平衡行政、臨床、科研、教學(xué)工作及個(gè)人生活？

How do you balance your personal life, administration, clinical practice, research activities and lecturing?

這是一個(gè)非常難的問(wèn)題，因?yàn)橛袝r(shí)（時(shí)間安排）會(huì)有沖突。對(duì)于我來(lái)說(shuō)，作為一名臨床醫(yī)生，我大部分的注意力都放在病人身上，我認(rèn)為專(zhuān)注于照護(hù)病人是我的義務(wù)。除此之外，行政工作也是必要的，否則我的科室無(wú)法運(yùn)轉(zhuǎn)。

科研和教學(xué)是抽空進(jìn)行的，教學(xué)的時(shí)間一般是根據(jù)學(xué)生課表而定，而科研的時(shí)間安排更有彈性。除去這些活動(dòng)，剩下的時(shí)間就是留給個(gè)人生活的。有時(shí)我感覺(jué)我留給個(gè)人生活的時(shí)間實(shí)在是太少了。但是沒(méi)辦法，這是我的職業(yè)決定的。我學(xué)醫(yī)的第一天起就意識(shí)到這一點(diǎn)了。所以假如一個(gè)人比較注重個(gè)人生活，那我不建議他選擇學(xué)術(shù)或科研道路。

This is a very difficult question because sometimes there are collisions. For me, as a physician involved with patient care, my patients often, if not to say, always have the first right to get my attention. I always feel obliged to really focus on treating my patients. Beyond that, certainly, administrative tasks are necessary in order to keep the department running.

Research is something along, like lecturing that can be done if you schedule your day, and then you can find the appropriate time slots. While lecturing is more or less given on the schedule for the students. Research projects, depending on the nature, have more flexibility. Well, now you see, adding up the last that's left is private life and sometimes I feel there's a little bit too little time for private life, but that comes along with the career. This is something I’ve known from day one. So if one rather has a focus on private life, pursuing an academic career and research might not be the way to recommend.

8、年輕醫(yī)生們?nèi)绾沃泪t(yī)院是否正在對(duì)他們進(jìn)行良好的培訓(xùn)？

How can a young doctor know if the hospital are giving them good training?

德國(guó)規(guī)定年輕醫(yī)生每年至少要與培訓(xùn)負(fù)責(zé)人進(jìn)行一次年度會(huì)談，這樣他們可以根據(jù)現(xiàn)狀適時(shí)調(diào)整培訓(xùn)計(jì)劃。

對(duì)于我的住院醫(yī)生來(lái)說(shuō)，我認(rèn)為在非正式情況下跟我討論培訓(xùn)進(jìn)度更重要，這樣他們可以及時(shí)告訴我他們?cè)谂嘤?xùn)中最想學(xué)到的東西。同樣，我也可以實(shí)時(shí)把握他們的進(jìn)度，并給他們合適的建議。

醫(yī)學(xué)生的培訓(xùn)包括掌握各種技能、接觸不同病人，并在不同科室之間輪轉(zhuǎn)。年輕醫(yī)生應(yīng)該盡早意識(shí)到，如果他們有機(jī)會(huì)去輪轉(zhuǎn)，他們會(huì)看到其他醫(yī)療機(jī)構(gòu)的進(jìn)修醫(yī)生和楷模醫(yī)生的培訓(xùn)是如何進(jìn)行的。如果你沒(méi)有去不同科室、不同領(lǐng)域輪轉(zhuǎn)的機(jī)會(huì)，你應(yīng)該盡快跟你的科室主任反映。

In Germany, it is mandatory to have at least an annual talk with the person responsible for the training. So that young doctors can readjust their plans based on what they've been experiencing so far. For my residents, I think it is more important to get in touch with me on short notice to talk to me without a formal scenario as well, so they can tell me what they pursue as most important for their training. Likewise, I see how they are doing, and I recommend to them how to continue with their training.

Training in medicine involves certain skills and exposure to different patients and rotations through different departments. And I think young doctors should early on realize if they have the opportunity to rotate, they can see from other more advanced doctors and their role models how training is happening at a certain institution. And if no such rotation through different departments, through different areas of procedures happens, this is something that should be brought up in a discussion with the department head early on.

9、您和您的科室為年輕人才提供了哪些支持？是否有專(zhuān)門(mén)培養(yǎng)下一代的指導(dǎo)計(jì)劃？

What support for young talents do you and your klinik offer? Are there mentoring programs that specifically support the next generation?

慕尼黑大學(xué)醫(yī)學(xué)院有這類(lèi)項(xiàng)目，我們會(huì)根據(jù)科研項(xiàng)目的先進(jìn)程度，保障年輕人才的科研時(shí)間和資金。這個(gè)項(xiàng)目叫 F?FoLe，致力于支持年輕的研究人員。在我們腎內(nèi)科也有類(lèi)似的計(jì)劃，保障年輕人才在輪轉(zhuǎn)過(guò)程中的研究時(shí)間，讓年輕醫(yī)生有更多可支配的時(shí)間。同時(shí)也鼓勵(lì)他們到其他機(jī)構(gòu)進(jìn)行研究和輪轉(zhuǎn)。但這因人而異而且取決于經(jīng)費(fèi)，所需經(jīng)費(fèi)不能超出科室或大學(xué)給的范圍。年輕醫(yī)生還可以通過(guò)德國(guó)自然科學(xué)基金會(huì)（DFG）申請(qǐng)科研資金，我們提供其他方面的支持。

For our department at the Ludwig Maximilian University, we do have mentoring programs that support a protected time for research, depending on the stage of how far advanced the research program is. That’s called F?FoLe, which supports early on research. The other support specifically we in nephrology give to young talents a more protected time through rotations in either not so demanding rotations, which gives the doctors a little bit free time. And also the support to go for research, and rotations elsewhere. But that is on an individual basis and depends on grants, which are then not out of the department or the university. But the German research foundation, the DFG always offers research grants that can be applied for, and then we support them.

10、對(duì)于想要從事腎內(nèi)科的年輕醫(yī)生/醫(yī)學(xué)生，您有什么建議？

What advice would you give to someone hoping to start a career in nephrology?

我會(huì)建議先了解清楚腎內(nèi)科的日常臨床工作，臨床情況不同會(huì)存在很多差異。腎內(nèi)科的門(mén)診服務(wù)包括一周六天的腎透析。意味著一周當(dāng)中有六天需要為病人提供服務(wù)，如果你想把這當(dāng)成終生職業(yè)，需要好好考慮這一點(diǎn)。如果選擇學(xué)術(shù)型道路，我會(huì)建議年輕醫(yī)生開(kāi)拓自己的眼界和想法，目前還有很多懸而未決的問(wèn)題都很值得我們研究。

我認(rèn)為每個(gè)對(duì)腎臟病學(xué)感興趣的人都應(yīng)該了解一下這些開(kāi)放性問(wèn)題，找到自己最感興趣的研究興趣，然后尋找一個(gè)專(zhuān)門(mén)從事這方面研究的機(jī)構(gòu)。

I would recommend really taking a close look at how nephrology is practiced. There is quite a diversity depending on clinical settings. Ambulatory or nephrology in just outpatient practice involves dialysis, which is a 6-day week. You always have to treat patients 6 days a week which really is an important fact to take into account for a lifelong career. If looking at scientific nephrology, I think one should look at the different aspects - there are so many open questions that still deserve research.

And I think every person interested in nephrology should look at these open questions and see which specific research interest is important to her or to him, and then find an institution where particularly that research can be pursued.

11、您在國(guó)際上知名度很高，至今您最自豪的職業(yè)成就是什么，為什么？

You enjoy great international reputation. What is your proudest career achievement to date and why?

大約15年前，我申請(qǐng)了美國(guó)密歇根大學(xué)醫(yī)療中心腎臟移植中心主任一職。在眾多競(jìng)聘者中，我收到了聘書(shū)，但我最終沒(méi)有接受。不過(guò)我很自豪能夠被密歇根大學(xué)這樣的知名機(jī)構(gòu)認(rèn)可，得到腎臟移植中心主任這個(gè)競(jìng)爭(zhēng)激烈的職位。

Well, about 15 years back, I applied for a position at the University of Michigan Ann Arbor Medical Center as a transplant director. And actually among many competitors, I was offered the position which eventually I didn't take. But it made me very proud to be recognized by such a prestigious institution as the University of Michigan Ann Arbor for such a highly competitive position as a director in clinical renal transplantation.

12、在中國(guó)一些地區(qū)許多病人因?yàn)閲?yán)格的疫情管控措施無(wú)法及時(shí)進(jìn)行治療，比如腎透析、腎移植等。對(duì)于這種情況德國(guó)是如何解決的？

China is now facing another wave of pandemic. Many patients are not able to receive proper treatment like dialysis or renal transplantation in due time due to the strict COVID-regulations. How is this dilemma be addressed in Germany?

在第一輪疫情時(shí)，我們推遲了活體移植項(xiàng)目。因?yàn)楫?dāng)時(shí)我們誤以為只要疫情結(jié)束，隨時(shí)都能進(jìn)行活體移植。

但是現(xiàn)在我們看到疫情還在持續(xù)，推遲任何手術(shù)都不是如此簡(jiǎn)單的事，即使是活體捐贈(zèng)。所以現(xiàn)在我們所有移植手術(shù)都照常運(yùn)行。至于遺體捐獻(xiàn)項(xiàng)目我們從來(lái)沒(méi)有推遲過(guò)，因?yàn)檫z體器官捐獻(xiàn)對(duì)手術(shù)時(shí)間有非常嚴(yán)格的要求。

從第一輪疫情我們意識(shí)到，即使是活體捐贈(zèng)項(xiàng)目，延遲也是不可行的。所以從第二輪疫情起我們不再延遲移植手術(shù)。術(shù)前我們會(huì)確認(rèn)捐獻(xiàn)者和受捐人都已接種新冠疫苗，并讓他們簽署知情同意書(shū)，了解術(shù)中的感染風(fēng)險(xiǎn)。對(duì)于透析患者來(lái)說(shuō)，我們認(rèn)為盡早接受移植手術(shù)后可以安心居家，比每周進(jìn)行三次透析更好，后者一定程度上有感染新冠或其他病原體的風(fēng)險(xiǎn)。

Early on in the first wave, we postponed our living donation transplant program. because we felt that this could be done any time after the COVID pandemic. Now we see that the pandemic is going on and it's not so easy to postpone surgery even projects such as living related donation.

So now we continue with transplant surgery. We have never stopped the deceased donor program, because you take the kidney or if you don't take it, you will have to bury it with the donors. We learned from the first wave that if you're trying to postpone procedures such as living related donation, it does not work well.

So ever since the second wave and from then on, we have been continuing with our transplant programs. We make sure our donors and recipients are vaccinated. We get informed consent that they all understand the small but real risk of contracting infection. Yet we feel that especially for dialysis patients, having a transplant and being able to stay at home is an advantage compared to having to come to a dialysis unit 3 times a week, which goes along with a certain risk of infection with COVID and other agents.

13、新冠肺炎疫情現(xiàn)在是醫(yī)療領(lǐng)域最大挑戰(zhàn)之一，您認(rèn)為這對(duì)您所在領(lǐng)域有何影響？

The COVID-19 pandemic is one of the biggest challenges facing modern healthcare. What impact do you see this having on the field of nephrology?

新冠疫情讓我們意識(shí)到我們必須保護(hù)患者免受感染，以及這在腎內(nèi)科有多困難。一周要進(jìn)行三次透析的病人每周都會(huì)在感染風(fēng)險(xiǎn)中暴露三次。如果透析室有疫情爆發(fā)將會(huì)是非常嚴(yán)重的問(wèn)題。這也是當(dāng)前大多數(shù)腎內(nèi)科醫(yī)生面對(duì)的主要問(wèn)題。

另一方面，正如我們剛剛討論過(guò)的一樣，我們意識(shí)到即使有新冠疫情，我們的治療都必須要繼續(xù)，比如透析、移植及腎病診斷等。

與其他擇期手術(shù)（如泌尿外科、骨科、眼科等）不同，腎內(nèi)科的治療無(wú)法延期，這都是維系病人生命的必要條件。這一點(diǎn)對(duì)之前沒(méi)有意識(shí)到持續(xù)提供腎臟病治療重要性的同事們來(lái)說(shuō)尤其明顯。所以我認(rèn)為疫情也讓大家意識(shí)到腎內(nèi)科的重要性。

COVID-19, made us realize how much we have to protect our patients from infections and how difficult that can be in renal units. Patients that have to come to dialysis 3 times a week are potentially exposed 3 times a week. If you have an outbreak of COVID in a dialysis unit, this is certainly a concern. This is a major practical problem that many nephrologists are dealing with these days.

On the other hand, as discussed earlier, we realized that treatment such as dialysis and transplantation and diagnosis of renal disease has to be continued despite the COVID pandemic. Unlike other fields as elective surgery in the urology, orthopedics, ophthalmology, treatment in nephrology must not be postponed, which is early on life-sustaining. And this is something that became very obvious to many colleagues who have not realized how crucial a constant availability of nephrology treatment is. So I think it helped the field to gain visibility with respect to the importance of nephrology.

14、假如您不從醫(yī)的話，您會(huì)從事什么行業(yè)？

What would you have been if you had not been a medical doctor?

因?yàn)槲乙恢币詠?lái)都對(duì)科學(xué)和生物學(xué)非常感興趣，我可能會(huì)想成為一名生物學(xué)家。隨著生物學(xué)的發(fā)展，我發(fā)現(xiàn)分子生物學(xué)也非常有意思。我不確定我會(huì)不會(huì)成為一名分子生物學(xué)家或從事其他領(lǐng)域，但是科學(xué)一定會(huì)是我職業(yè)生涯的重點(diǎn)。

Because I always found science very interesting and also found biology very interesting, I probably would have been a biologist. And now with the many advances in biology, I find molecular biology very interesting, but I'm not sure if I would have been a molecular biologist or in some other field, but science certainly would have been the focus of my professional life. 

15、除了醫(yī)學(xué)外，您還有什么興趣愛(ài)好？

What are your hobbies outside medicine?

根據(jù)不同季節(jié)我喜歡做不同的休閑運(yùn)動(dòng)，平時(shí)我喜歡跟高中時(shí)代的朋友們一起打壁球。到了相應(yīng)的季節(jié)，滑雪也是非常美妙的運(yùn)動(dòng)，尤其是我所在的慕尼黑就在阿爾卑斯山腳下。如果我出國(guó)的話，我也偶爾玩一下水肺潛水。運(yùn)動(dòng)之余，我也喜歡欣賞表演藝術(shù)，我偶爾會(huì)看歌劇或者芭蕾舞表演，這些都是我在疫情封城期間錯(cuò)過(guò)的事情。除此之外，我也喜歡去畫(huà)廊看藝術(shù)品，雖然我不是藝術(shù)方面的專(zhuān)家。

There are a few recreational sports independent of the season. I like to play squash with friends back from high school. And then depending on the season, skiing is a wonderful sport, especially here in Munich with the Alps so close by. And I also enjoy scuba diving once in a while if I go abroad.

Outside sports, I love performing arts, and I go to the opera or watch a ballet once in a while. And this is certainly something I missed during the lockdown. Aside from that, I enjoy going to galleries and looking at artwork, although I would not call myself an expert on arts.